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  1. #1
    M&S Senior Member nitrokiller123's Avatar
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    Cool Doug's 4-Day Split.......... "The Thread"

    Being probably the most popular workout in here, and the one Im currently working on, I think it would be cool if we can all discuss it here! I think alot of new people come here looking to get bigger and looking for a reliable workout, and I think this one is pretty much flawless.

    I am currently on my 4th weeks and have gained about 5-6 lbs, I am very happy with the results so far and plan to do it for 8 weeks and switch into something different for another 8 weeks.

    What have your gains been so far and how long have you been on Doug's 4DS?? Also, If you are a Doug's 4DS veteran (lol) what were your experiences with it?

    Of course, thanks to Doug for such an awesome workout. I love it so far

    Discuss away!!!
    21 yrs old
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    BF% : 15-17% (probably) lol
    Goal: 180 lbs, 12%BF

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    Doug's was my first actual workout a couple years ago. I went from 117 to 135 pounds over the summer. I was truly astounded with my gains. Of course I was reading up on here and got my diet down as well. I still had a few cheat meals each week but for the most part it was lean chicken and steaks with lots of pasta that I ate. Pasta was for soccer.

    It also helped that I was a beginner then. When I finished with it I tapered off due to soccer and stabilized around 130. Great workout though. Definitely had to check my ego at the door when I walked into the gym for the first time.
    Stats: Age 19, 5'8", 138lbs, 6% bf
    Goal: 150lbs then marathon training

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    Good idea!

    I need a replacement exercise for Dumbell Reverse Flys. I really just don't like that exercise at all. Any advice?
    12 Week Bulk Started 2.24.10
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    Using Dave's VIF

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    NOT ripped, NOT concerned LtL's Avatar
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    Reverse Cable Flies would be good.

    LtL

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    M&S Senior Member nitrokiller123's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rogerdap View Post
    Good idea!

    I need a replacement exercise for Dumbell Reverse Flys. I really just don't like that exercise at all. Any advice?
    I THOUGHT EXACTLY THE SAME THIN!!! Those things feel really awkward when I do them, and I know I wasnt doing them right. My gym has a pec fly machine which you can use in reverse to work the back shoulders, so thats what I replaced them with. hope you can find someway to replace them cause they are hard to do correctly in my opinion.
    21 yrs old
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    BF% : 15-17% (probably) lol
    Goal: 180 lbs, 12%BF

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    Exact same thoughts.
    12 Week Bulk Started 2.24.10
    Starting Weight -- 162 lbs.
    Current Weight -- 163 lbs.
    Using Dave's VIF

  7. #7
    Regular Poster Warno's Avatar
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    I don't have a smith machine in my gym right now so I switched to either dumbbell or barbell shoulder presses, whichever is open when I get there.

    I just started the program yesterday though, looks good, I needed a new routine.

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    Regular Poster Warno's Avatar
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    Just got back from the the second workout of the week (Back and Abs).

    I definatley can't do 12 wide grip pull-ups so I put my hands shoulder width and then I could do about 12, I kept going wider as the amount of sets went down.

    I can do about 4 with a wide grip...

    what is better:

    To do what I did? or to do about 12 negative wide grips?

  9. #9
    Psychosociety Graeme's Avatar
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    I used D4DS as a base to make my own workout.. There are some parts I like, and others that I dont like about D4DS.. Not a fan of smith machine work.

    Q : Why does this workout call for smith machine shoulder press? I tried these and I added 30 pounds to what I would use for military press.. and it felt easier.
    Squat 2.1x BW Squat, 1.75xBW Bench Press, 2.5xBW Deadlift (425/350/500)
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  10. #10
    Regular Poster Warno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Graeme666 View Post
    I used D4DS as a base to make my own workout.. There are some parts I like, and others that I dont like about D4DS.. Not a fan of smith machine work.

    Q : Why does this workout call for smith machine shoulder press? I tried these and I added 30 pounds to what I would use for military press.. and it felt easier.
    I always thought the smith machine took off a lot of the weight from the bar?? Maybe making the bar weighing 10 pounds instead of 45?? I don't know if that is right but I always felt that is how it is because I can always do more weight using a smith machine.


    When do you do your forearms and abs?

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    The Strategist Frankoman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warno View Post
    I always thought the smith machine took off a lot of the weight from the bar?? Maybe making the bar weighing 10 pounds instead of 45?? I don't know if that is right but I always felt that is how it is because I can always do more weight using a smith machine.


    When do you do your forearms and abs?
    I think it feels lighter too. Maybe it is because we don't have to try as hard to stabilize the bar and keep control?

    Anyways, when I finish my routine and get my whey mix in I am going to start D4DS for 8 weeks. I hope I can make good gains! I'm spending a lot of time now preparing how my bulk diet will be.
    "If a job is worth doing, it's worth doing properly."

    "You've got to build the house before you paint it." - muscletrainerd

    "Bodybuilding is a marathon; not a sprint." - Coach

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    Stabalizer muscles aren't used with the Smith Machine and the bar is only 15 lbs.
    12 Week Bulk Started 2.24.10
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    Current Weight -- 163 lbs.
    Using Dave's VIF

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    Hey guys just wondering with this workout and how the reps decrease (i.e. 12, 10, 8, 6) should i be adding weight between each set? or should I just naturally be able to do less each set with a certain weight?

  14. #14
    Psychosociety Graeme's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rogerdap View Post
    Stabalizer muscles aren't used with the Smith Machine and the bar is only 15 lbs.
    At my gym its written as 45 pounds. =)

    @ ead .. if you can only manage the same weight for all of your sets, that is fine.. try to increase by 5 pounds if you meet the reps for all sets.. if that is too much, then add 5 pounds to your 6 rep set, then gradually build up to doing all of your sets with that weight.

    @ warno, i dont train forearms separately.. and I do my abs on tuesdays, and then obliques on fridays.

    @ frank, good man taking care of your diet.. if you can eat alot of oatmeal, chicken breast, vegetables and rice .. you will be fine. LOL
    Last edited by Graeme; 06-16-2009 at 10:54 PM.
    Squat 2.1x BW Squat, 1.75xBW Bench Press, 2.5xBW Deadlift (425/350/500)
    205 lbs @7%

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    @ ead .. if you can only manage the same weight for all of your sets, that is fine.. try to increase by 5 pounds if you meet the reps for all sets.. if that is too much, then add 5 pounds to your 6 rep set, then gradually build up to doing all of your sets with that weight.
    So should i be really aiming for adding weight to satisfy the gradual decline in reps? or just finding a weight that I can get it to come naturally?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rogerdap View Post
    Good idea!

    I need a replacement exercise for Dumbell Reverse Flys. I really just don't like that exercise at all. Any advice?
    Dumbbell Reverse Flys is a great exercise when performed correctly. I had the same problem and was of the opinion is was useless. However when I dropped the weight a bit, watched the videos on this website and youtube and concentrated on my form it ended up being a great exercise!

    It's important to use light weights and focus on your form, if it helps you can try performing this exercise standing up as well........

    Try it and see how it goes.

    P.S. Dougs 4 day split is great!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Warno View Post
    Just got back from the the second workout of the week (Back and Abs).

    I definatley can't do 12 wide grip pull-ups so I put my hands shoulder width and then I could do about 12, I kept going wider as the amount of sets went down.

    I can do about 4 with a wide grip...

    what is better:

    To do what I did? or to do about 12 negative wide grips?

    I'm in the same boat as you, I don't have enough upper body strength yet for my weight and I can't get nearly 12 wide grip pull ups.

    I do whatever I can on wide grip pull ups, to hit that muscle, and then do 12, 10, 8, 6 on a lat pulldown machine to target the same area.

    Ideally, if you have one of those weight assisted pull up machines you should use that, but my gym doesn't have one.

    Have went from being able to do sets of 1, 1, 1, 1 to 2, 2, 1, 1 eventually to 3, 3, 3, 3 so I'll get there....eventually.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Graeme666 View Post
    At my gym its written as 45 pounds. =)

    @ ead .. if you can only manage the same weight for all of your sets, that is fine.. try to increase by 5 pounds if you meet the reps for all sets.. if that is too much, then add 5 pounds to your 6 rep set, then gradually build up to doing all of your sets with that weight.
    That's interesting Graeme666....I'm maybe doing this wrong.

    I'm doing pyramid sets so typically adding 5kg with every decline in rep so for example at the moment, when I'm benching with dumbells I'm doing:

    12 x 22.5kg (45kg), 10x25kg (50kg), 8x27.5kg (55kg) and 6x30 (60kg)kg.

    Noticed when I try and move up a weight I can manage 12x25 but by the time I get to 6x32.5 my form is poor for the last couple.

    Maybe I need to rethink this!?!
    Last edited by Morientes; 06-17-2009 at 11:12 AM.

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    Stealth Mod Saurus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rogerdap View Post
    Good idea!

    I need a replacement exercise for Dumbell Reverse Flys. I really just don't like that exercise at all. Any advice?
    My guess is that you're doing too heavy. 1-3kg is more than enough.

    Anyway, if you're not going to do them (even though you should), then best replace them with Doug's suggestion:

    Prone Reverse Raises.
    (Shamelessly plagiarized from Doug's thread, http://www.muscleandstrength.com/for...shoulders.html)

    The purpose of this exercise is to work the posterior deltoid/outer trapezius in a way that no other movement can
    (a) Lie down on a bench high enough so that your arms can extend down to the sides without touching the floor. If no bench is available, you can do this exercise whilst standing and bent over, torso parallel to the floor.
    (b) Holding a dumbell in each hand, palms facing forward, slowly and deliberately bring the arms up and back, along side your body. Keep the arms straight throughout.
    (c) Return the weight to the original position and repeat.
    3 sets x 10-12 reps
    A person is only as big as the dream they dare to live.

  20. #20
    Regular Poster Warno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morientes View Post
    I'm in the same boat as you, I don't have enough upper body strength yet for my weight and I can't get nearly 12 wide grip pull ups.

    I do whatever I can on wide grip pull ups, to hit that muscle, and then do 12, 10, 8, 6 on a lat pulldown machine to target the same area.

    Ideally, if you have one of those weight assisted pull up machines you should use that, but my gym doesn't have one.

    Have went from being able to do sets of 1, 1, 1, 1 to 2, 2, 1, 1 eventually to 3, 3, 3, 3 so I'll get there....eventually.

    Yeah I feel your pain man, I can do about 4, 4, 3, 3.... I guess I am going to do what you do from now on.
    So do you super-set your wide grips with lat pull downs? Or do you do four sets straight and then do four more on the pull down machine?

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    I think I have found that it is easy to get on the bad form train. I have noticed my form has gotten worse over the last few weeks. I don't know why but it seemed I was making good increases.

    Now, I have stopped my creatine intake and replaced it with ZMA, and this may have something to do with it. OR it may be my pre workout meal the last 2 days wasn't the usual half chicken breast with vegetables and was a PB, Banana Sandwhich with Honey.

    Anyhow, either I am going to have to back the weight down if tommorrow my progress slows on Chest and Biceps with the normal preworkout meal.

    Also, I noticed that on my back day(yesterday), my Bentover Barbell raise form was hindered and I was unable to bring the bar all the way up to my chest? Just posting some observations from my workout.
    12 Week Bulk Started 2.24.10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warno View Post
    Yeah I feel your pain man, I can do about 4, 4, 3, 3.... I guess I am going to do what you do from now on.
    So do you super-set your wide grips with lat pull downs? Or do you do four sets straight and then do four more on the pull down machine?
    Tried supersets mate, but found I was really struggling with the pull ups so just get the low reps out that I am the now.

    As I reckon pull ups is the way to go I do whatever I can with that first and usually have plenty of energy to do a good set of wide grip pull downs. Gonna be ages on that until I can 12, 10, 8, 6 the wide grip pull up!

    Good luck though mate

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    I this workout, Dumbell shrug is placed in the shoulders, but isnt it for trapezes?

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    M&S Elite Member sloppyjoe's Avatar
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    I remember my first and only bulk i started with dougs 4 day and it did wonders. but then again a lot of it was my diet but dougs is a great workout for anybody.

  25. #25
    The Strategist Frankoman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Graeme666 View Post
    @ frank, good man taking care of your diet.. if you can eat alot of oatmeal, chicken breast, vegetables and rice .. you will be fine. LOL
    Thanks, Chicken and veggies i'll be fine with, same thing with oatmeal.. But rice wise I really only like rise pilaf! if thats ok..
    "If a job is worth doing, it's worth doing properly."

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