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    Default 6'6" need help! Ectomorph?!?

    Hey everyone...I'm 6'6" and 220 lbs. and have been tall and lanky my whole life. I want to take my abilities in the gym to the next level!!! I've been lifting for a solid 2 years and have not been able to see significant gains! Some of my friends told me I was an ECTOMORPH and that can effect my gains? Any advice on what to do?

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    Regular Poster itsn8o's Avatar
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    The good news is that Ectomorphs don't really exist.

    Ectomorph = person who habitually doesn't eat enough. Over time your body has made the adjustments required to live off 1,500 calories a day.

    The first step for you is to calculate BMR (Base Metabolic Rate) and add 500 calories, based on your height, I'm going to guess your true BMR is 3000 calories. Therefore you need to eat 3500 Calories a day.

    Make sure you consume 1.5g of Protein per LBS of body mass. For the balance of calories, Carbs:Fats should be split 75/25 on lifting days and 50/50 on resting days. There's more information in Articles > Diet & Nutrition > Beginners. I recommend you read the absolute crap out of every diet/nutrition article here.

    The second step is to pick a good program. Have a look at some of the beginners programs on this site, I'd recommend a fullbody program for a beginner because you will train with the main lifts more frequently and be able to practice your form. This will pay dividends later. I really like All Pros routine because it is fool proof (props to Dday for bringing this program to my attention). You know exactly what you have to do before you walk into the gym.

    The final step is rest. Try to get at least 6 hours sleep in. 8-10 is ideal, but you can get by on 6. It can be tough to get good sleep during the week, so make sure you treat yourself to a sleep in on the weekends.
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  3. #3
    Dark Meat dday39's Avatar
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    body types/somatotypes are bogus. everyone is a mix of all 3.

    regardless of training, you won't gain mass if you don't eat enough.

    calculate BMR/TDEE and eat 300-500 cals above maintenance. Try to consume at least 1g of protein per 1lb of bodyweight. Adjust cals as needed to maintain steady weight gain of about 1lb per week.

    itsn8o nailed everything else

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    No, they are not bogus. Some people have faster metabolisms than other. I have to eat 1000 calories above my calculated BMR to gain any weight.

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    Regular Poster itsn8o's Avatar
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    No, they are not bogus. Some people have faster metabolisms than other. I have to eat 1000 calories above my calculated BMR to gain any weight.
    Only if they have thyroid problems.

    For almost everyone, your metabolism speed is proportional to the amount you eat. i.e. eat more, faster metabolism. Eat less, slower metabolism.

    Dday is correct. Hargainer/ectos are 99.999% of the time people who don't eat enough. The guys who eat 1500 calories of muffins and lattes and wonder why they can't gain muscle mass.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveBX View Post
    Hey everyone...I'm 6'6" and 220 lbs. and have been tall and lanky my whole life. I want to take my abilities in the gym to the next level!!! I've been lifting for a solid 2 years and have not been able to see significant gains! Some of my friends told me I was an ECTOMORPH and that can effect my gains? Any advice on what to do?
    Body types do exist, IMO...though, I don't believe they make any muscle gain harder, they just give a different look to the body due to the length of the muscle etc.

    I say they do exist because my sister and myself have around 1" height difference between us and she is a slender frame (ecto; at just over 5") and I'm more a meso (at the same height range), as kids, standing side by side, both of us almost identical weight and height you can clearly see a difference.

    However, I don't put much stock in categorising people as different body types either because there is little point, it serves no good purpose. If someone is finding it difficult to gain lean mass, it's just a case of eating more; it's that simple, don't go making it complex otherwise you start placing obstacles in your way.



    @Senkoy - Once people become active (or are growing through their youth etc), eating and such, the metabolism alters and most of us find we need a lot more food...when I do cardio, I have to eat like a maniac just to maintain weight...and it is true that many state they have a high metabolism when they're just not eating enough to cover their activity, even though it takes a lot sometimes to eat enough, as I found out some years back.
    1-Finger Deadlift, 1RM: 80.3lbs/36.5kg

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    VENI VIDI VICI Gabro's Avatar
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    bodytypes exist. are they an excuse to dont build a good amount of muscles? HELL NO.

    the problem must be the trainning, if you dont train hard you just dont get really hungry to feed properly your muscles and actually grow. its not a thing about just putting more food and expect that c/p/f transform into muscle tissue.
    I do not count reps, I make every rep count !!

    175cm/75kg

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    i'm 6-4 and naturally thin but with consistent training and hardy eating anyone can bulk. my best results were from training to failure, only doing 3-4 sets to FAILURE, not where the weight is hard or i'm feeling tired, but to where i cannot move the a centimeter if my life depended on it. I like to follow a few intense sets with a few sets of good ole' volume work. eat complex carbs, tons of protein, and SLEEP. rest is extremely important. also check your supplements too. i like anything that can be sold at a professional level such as in a doctor or chiropracters office.

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    Quote Originally Posted by itsn8o View Post
    The good news is that Ectomorphs don't really exist.

    Ectomorph = person who habitually doesn't eat enough. Over time your body has made the adjustments required to live off 1,500 calories a day.

    The first step for you is to calculate BMR (Base Metabolic Rate) and add 500 calories, based on your height, I'm going to guess your true BMR is 3000 calories. Therefore you need to eat 3500 Calories a day.

    Make sure you consume 1.5g of Protein per LBS of body mass. For the balance of calories, Carbs:Fats should be split 75/25 on lifting days and 50/50 on resting days. There's more information in Articles > Diet & Nutrition > Beginners. I recommend you read the absolute crap out of every diet/nutrition article here.

    The second step is to pick a good program. Have a look at some of the beginners programs on this site, I'd recommend a fullbody program for a beginner because you will train with the main lifts more frequently and be able to practice your form. This will pay dividends later. I really like All Pros routine because it is fool proof (props to Dday for bringing this program to my attention). You know exactly what you have to do before you walk into the gym.

    The final step is rest. Try to get at least 6 hours sleep in. 8-10 is ideal, but you can get by on 6. It can be tough to get good sleep during the week, so make sure you treat yourself to a sleep in on the weekends.
    ^^THIS^^

    I'm 6'4 and was 196. Much lankier than you at 220. I started eating 3500-4000 cals spread over 6 meals. Keep the macro ratio to 30/50/20 P/C/F and do Doug's bulldozer 4 day split. I am now 206 and am lifting more each day. Mutant Mass has helped me reach the calories without bloating. 10 lbs in 3 months BTW and my waist has stayed the same.

    Good luck

  10. #10
    E-Cowboy 2cents madjinx's Avatar
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    Default Re: 6'6" need help! Ectomorph?!?

    at 6' 6" I wouldn't doubt the average person needs 4k+ cals a day to gain . I'm 5'4" and need 3200 to "clean" bulk.

    I don't think people realize how little they eat at first. Then you spend a few weeks really tracking your food and you see you aren't even at 2k cals.
    Current Supps: Controlled Labs Orange Triad, NOW Foods Ultra Omega-3, EvoMuse: Gut Health

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    I think the problem with this debate is people automatically think that when someone says they're an ectomorph they're making an excuse and that's not the case. It's just clear that some people naturally burn more calories than others. It's like having different fuel efficiency. Saying everybody's metabolism is the same is like saying everybody is the same height or has the same skeletal structure or something like that. People are different from one another and in how they burn calories is no different.

    This is not today it's a valid excuse, because barring some health issues, anyone can get big, but it wont be the same for everyone. Some people can grow eating just 500 calories above maintenance. I'm eating over 1000 calories above maintenance and growing extremely slowly (but still growing). On the other hand, cutting should be very easy for me. My body burns through fat at a ridiculous rate it seems.

    And just as an example of different metabolisms, I used to eat more than my sister and was far less active than her yet I was extremely skinny and she was fat. It's just different metabolisms. You can affect it by how much you eat, but everyone has different base metabolisms.

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    Seeking Alternatives 0606196t's Avatar
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    ^^

    get the calories in. Sounds silly but some guys at that height are eating like 5000kcal+ My mate who is 6"8 eats like 4000kcal on a quiet day and drinks like a beast on the weekends. Still lanky.

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    I'm losing respect for these forums. Body types do exist, as well as different metabolisms, etc... Identifying yours, or what your body responds to well, is part of the process of 'body-building'. Some people respond well to low carb diets, some don't, some people respond well to certain rep-ranges, some don't, so on and so forth... The most important thing you will ever do is identify what works for yourself, sometimes this takes years...

    To the OP, the most important things I have found over the years (in broad category) are
    Intensity of Lifts
    Mind to Muscle Contractions
    Diet
    CONSISTENCY

    Not in any specific order...

  14. #14
    E-Cowboy 2cents madjinx's Avatar
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    Default Re: 6'6" need help! Ectomorph?!?

    just had to say

    Steve is technically an ecto.
    Current Supps: Controlled Labs Orange Triad, NOW Foods Ultra Omega-3, EvoMuse: Gut Health

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    WOW!!! Nice Post!Kind Regards.


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    different bone structures exist, the tall, the small, the broad individual etc

    but linking metabolism to bone structure is nonsense
    220lbs, 13-14%bf,


    Hypertrophy is something that can be achieved with pretty much any intensity of load, as long as the work is progressive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JeremySVilla View Post
    WOW!!! Nice Post!Kind Regards.

    Someone ban this user.

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    Dark Meat dday39's Avatar
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    to clarify, body types exist, but the science is bunk. everyone is a mix of all 3. there are no 'pure' ectomorphs (or any others). if you are gaining weight slowly, you aren't eating 1000 cals above maintenance. plain and simple. you're most likely eating 200-300 above maintenance. the number a formula spits out is a good starting point, but there isn't a body type out there that can't bulk at 1,000 cals above their actual maintenance.

    people with lower body fat and higher LBM are going to have the faster metabolism. sedentary individuals will gain weight eating less cals than active people. its no surprise

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    Quote Originally Posted by madjinx View Post
    at 6' 6" I wouldn't doubt the average person needs 4k+ cals a day to gain . I'm 5'4" and need 3200 to "clean" bulk.

    I don't think people realize how little they eat at first. Then you spend a few weeks really tracking your food and you see you aren't even at 2k cals.
    Bingo!

    Quote Originally Posted by xcoyote View Post
    I'm losing respect for these forums. Body types do exist, as well as different metabolisms, etc... Identifying yours, or what your body responds to well, is part of the process of 'body-building'. Some people respond well to low carb diets, some don't, some people respond well to certain rep-ranges, some don't, so on and so forth... The most important thing you will ever do is identify what works for yourself, sometimes this takes years...

    To the OP, the most important things I have found over the years (in broad category) are
    Intensity of Lifts
    Mind to Muscle Contractions
    Diet
    CONSISTENCY

    Not in any specific order...
    Yes, body types exist, but I don't think they are that useful. I was an ecto. I was 6' and 155 out of high school. I was 6'2" and 175 when I got married. I was 191 when I reentered the gym after a serious shoulder injury. Now I am 240 pounds and I look like a mesomorph.

    I guess my point is, what you look like today is not determinative of what you can look like in a year or three.

    Of the list you mentioned, I think consistency is the most important thing as you have to bring consistency to diet, rest, and training in order to see results. I didn't focus on my body-type when I bulked. I focused on training without missing sessions and eating the correct amount of calories.
    "Look son, there comes a time in every man's life when he has to make a decision. Do you want to be big, powerful, jacked, yoked-up, have women everywhere want you and men fear you . . . or do you want to do CrossFit?"

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    Regular Poster itsn8o's Avatar
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    Whilst the body type exists, it's not a product of genetics but rather under-eating.

    Most people who jump onto the ecto label identify with it as 'genetically skinny' and 'cannot gain weight', which is not true.
    That is why I deny ectos actually exist. Genetically skinny, cannot gain weight no matter what I do types don't exist. All that exists is under-eaters (ectos) who are skinny because their body has adjusted to live off 1500 calories a day.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MC View Post
    Bingo!


    Yes, body types exist, but I don't think they are that useful. I was an ecto. I was 6' and 155 out of high school. I was 6'2" and 175 when I got married. I was 191 when I reentered the gym after a serious shoulder injury. Now I am 240 pounds and I look like a mesomorph.

    I guess my point is, what you look like today is not determinative of what you can look like in a year or three.

    Of the list you mentioned, I think consistency is the most important thing as you have to bring consistency to diet, rest, and training in order to see results. I didn't focus on my body-type when I bulked. I focused on training without missing sessions and eating the correct amount of calories.
    I agree on pretty much all points, I also think you can "change" body types, they are very much based on your lifestyle, and age, I would have probably been described as a Ecto when I was in High School, then I bloated Up (looked Endo) when I stopped running track, then I hit the weights, and am boxing and look very much Meso...

    I also agree that "worrying" about bodytypes is pointless but I do think it's important to listen and adapt to how your body responds.

  22. #22
    VENI VIDI VICI Gabro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by madjinx View Post
    just had to say

    Steve is technically an ecto.
    Also is Frank Zane.


    people get it wrong its not about making excuse with which bodytye you are (ecto cant gain weight or endo cant get ripped)

    its about knowing your bone structure and your current condition without start trainning yet and determine a good plan based on this (giving the same behavious changes, diet, trainning and cardio for a fat and skinny guy will be wrong)
    I do not count reps, I make every rep count !!

    175cm/75kg

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gabro View Post
    its about knowing your bone structure and your current condition without start trainning yet and determine a good plan based on this (giving the same behavious changes, diet, trainning and cardio for a fat and skinny guy will be wrong)
    I agree, Gabro. The more etco you are (and the taller you are) the more weight you are going to need to gain to become muscular. You should BULK.

    If you are an meso, you can also likely just bulk. If you are an endo, you might want to consider leaning down a bit first, unless you prefer to just pack on more muscles and not worry about BF% at the onset.
    "Look son, there comes a time in every man's life when he has to make a decision. Do you want to be big, powerful, jacked, yoked-up, have women everywhere want you and men fear you . . . or do you want to do CrossFit?"

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    Quote Originally Posted by dday39 View Post
    to clarify, body types exist, but the science is bunk. everyone is a mix of all 3. there are no 'pure' ectomorphs (or any others). if you are gaining weight slowly, you aren't eating 1000 cals above maintenance. plain and simple. you're most likely eating 200-300 above maintenance. the number a formula spits out is a good starting point, but there isn't a body type out there that can't bulk at 1,000 cals above their actual maintenance.

    people with lower body fat and higher LBM are going to have the faster metabolism. sedentary individuals will gain weight eating less cals than active people. its no surprise

    I agree. My argument was against saying they are just bogus. But I agree we are all some degree of all three, but some lean towards one more than others. When I say I'm eating 1000 cal above maintenance, I mean my calculated maintenance. I do think I'm more of an ecto and my actual maintenance will therefore be higher than the average person of my height, weight and activity level. Not saying I cant get big (I know I will), but I just have to eat a bit more than a non ecto.

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    Seasoned M&S Veteran AToE's Avatar
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    Calculated maintainance is winging it at best - for example the calc on this site says (for me) about 3000cal and the one at my gym (based on body comp tests) says 1900. That's a HUGE discrepancy, huge - even if I decide (which I have) that neither is reliable, my maint seems to be around 2300-2500 cal. So eating any amount over "calc" maintainance is meaningless when refering to bodytype, according to this site's calc I need to eat way less than it saying, making me "endo" theoretically. According to my gym's calc I need to eat way over what they say, making me "ecto" theoretically.

    You get my point, the issue isn't how much over calc maint you need to eat, it's WHOSE calc maintainance that makes all the difference.

    That said my bone structure type is somewhere between ecto and meso as best as I can tell, so I'm not saying I don't believe in the bodytypes - I'm just saying that I have no idea if the bodytypes truely have anything at all to do with metabolism.
    Last edited by AToE; 09-14-2012 at 01:43 AM.

 

 

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