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  1. #1
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    Default Really bad genes??

    Hey guys I'm a 25 year old guy, 5'8" 175 lbs. I've been trying to lower my bodyfat % for years now and it doesn't seem to be working. I mean I can lose weight on the scale easily but I don't see more definition, the bioimpedence machines always tell me around 15% no matter what I do. I follow pretty much every advice I've seen on this forum about fat loss, have a super clean diet, workout hard 4-5 times a week. my bf percentage just always seems to be around 15% Do you guys think it's possible that my genes are just very bad adn It's impossible for my body to be under that number? thanks.

  2. #2
    Psychosociety Graeme's Avatar
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    Is it possible that after 5-10 years of training you should be using the athlete rating of BF instead of the average person? I am not entirely sure on how accurate those machines are in general, too many variables. Just assume it's a fair bit off unless it was a fairly upper scale priced machine.
    Squat 2.1x BW Squat, 1.75xBW Bench Press, 2.5xBW Deadlift (425/350/500)
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    VENI VIDI VICI Gabro's Avatar
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    Havent listened a guy that can't not reveal his abs due to genetics yet, genetics are more about height, bone structure, muscle attachs, aesthetics, etc..''how gifted you are''. Tell us more about your trainning, lift maxes, diet, habits, a pic will also help to try to understand.
    I do not count reps, I make every rep count !!

    175cm/75kg

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    M&S Elite Member Edgar's Avatar
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    Default

    How are you dieting? Do you know how many calories you are eating in a day?

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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gabro View Post
    Havent listened a guy that can't not reveal his abs due to genetics yet, genetics are more about height, bone structure, muscle attachs, aesthetics, etc..''how gifted you are''. Tell us more about your trainning, lift maxes, diet, habits, a pic will also help to try to understand.
    Well genes also decide the amount of testosterone you produce which is a huge factor no?

    My training:
    I have a 4 day split, workou 4-5 times a week, 10-16 series each muscle group, pyramidal mostly 12-10-8-6
    Lift maxes I dont know them precisely, maybe 225 for pecs legs I don't know but more than most ppl

    Diet, pretty much impecable, basically 4 first meals of the day being complex carbs with a low fat meat (usually chicken or fish) and veggies, last two meals usually a salad with some cheese and eggs and nuts and cheese with a bit of casein prot before bed.

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    Default

    About 3000

  7. #7
    VENI VIDI VICI Gabro's Avatar
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    Default

    At the end, dont let genetics get into your head, we all have them, I personally would loved to born with diferent genetics also.
    I do not count reps, I make every rep count !!

    175cm/75kg

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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dario2622 View Post
    Hey guys I'm a 25 year old guy, 5'8" 175 lbs. I've been trying to lower my bodyfat % for years now and it doesn't seem to be working. I mean I can lose weight on the scale easily but I don't see more definition, the bioimpedence machines always tell me around 15% no matter what I do. I follow pretty much every advice I've seen on this forum about fat loss, have a super clean diet, workout hard 4-5 times a week. my bf percentage just always seems to be around 15% Do you guys think it's possible that my genes are just very bad adn It's impossible for my body to be under that number? thanks.
    I'm in pretty much the exact same boat as you, I'm 24 5'8" and between 175 and 180 lbs. My body fat tends to stick around as well. My dad tells me all the time it's just not in our family genes to have a six pack. You just gotta decide how much you want it and how hard you're willing to work for it. If you're stuck just work harder. Stick to your plan and keep working hard and the results will come. That's what I keep telling myself.

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    Well I've been doing the maximum I can do (with the knowledge I have on the subject, which is pretty considerable I would say) for years and it seems like the only way I could do it is to get a liposuccion..

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    M&S Elite Member TASan's Avatar
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    Default

    Testosterone is not that big of a factor, actually. Anyone without serious medical problems producing this hormone should be able to get great results from strength training (even in the lower end of testosterone producing individuals).

    Can you tell us a bit more about the strategies you have used to lose the last few lbs covering your abs? LayzieBone should probably know a good bit about this too BTW, try to PM him if he does not post here
    <-- If anyone is helpful, be sure to click the star in the bottom left corner and spread some REPS!

    B.Sc. in Sport Science with specialisation in Physical Activity and Health
    Certified Personal Trainer

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    Seasoned M&S Veteran AToE's Avatar
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    I agree, unless you have a medical dissorder your test should be fine, maybe not super high or anything, but fine.

    Here's a thought - why not bulk for 6 months (slowly so as to not add too much fat), then go back to cutting? Every time I stall out on a cut I just switch back to bulking, then when I do go back to a cut it's easy again for the first while because my metabolism is ramped up. Also, the more muscle mass you have, the less low you'll need to get your bodyfat % in order to look the way you want to. I know a guy with lots of muscle, and even at 16% bodyfat he has visible abs. Now, you're not going to get to that size any time soon, but still, if more muscle can make the difference between 8% bodyfat and 10% bodyfat looking the way you want to, why not go for it?

  12. #12
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dario2622 View Post
    Well genes also decide the amount of testosterone you produce which is a huge factor no?

    My training:
    I have a 4 day split, workou 4-5 times a week, 10-16 series each muscle group, pyramidal mostly 12-10-8-6
    Lift maxes I dont know them precisely, maybe 225 for pecs legs I don't know but more than most ppl

    Diet, pretty much impecable, basically 4 first meals of the day being complex carbs with a low fat meat (usually chicken or fish) and veggies, last two meals usually a salad with some cheese and eggs and nuts and cheese with a bit of casein prot before bed.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dario2622 View Post
    About 3000

    That may be your stumbling block, as RichKnapp, on the forum, would say, it's not enough to know "about" how much you intake, it's about knowing exactly what you consume, macros and all, down to the last digit, that's what gets those illusive end results for those that are after them.
    1-Finger Deadlift, 1RM: 80.3lbs/36.5kg

  13. #13
    M&S Elite Member Edgar's Avatar
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    Default

    3000 calories at your weight and height? That sounds like the culprit. I'm also 5'8 and to get shredded (full 6 pack), I started at around 185-190 and ate about 2600 calories a day, once I hit 170-175, I had to lower it further to 2200, that got me to about 160-165 and a full six pack.

    Just sounds like you need to lower your calories, you're doing everything else right, just putting too much fuel in the body and not letting a natural calorie deficit occur.

  14. #14
    Frequent Poster PGio's Avatar
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    Default

    The first step is to determine how many calories you actually need per day. Using the Harris-Benedict formula

    66 + (6.3 x weight in lbs) + (12.9 x height in inches) - (6.8 x age in years)


    So for you,

    66 + (6.3 x 175) + (12.9 x 68) - (6.8 x 24)
    66 + (1102.5) + (877.2) - (163.2) = 1882.5

    Now, this is your Basal Metabolic Rate, without factoring in how active you are. Since you say you workout hard 4-5 times a week we need to multiply this by the appropriate activity factor, which is 1.55

    1882.5 x 1.55 = 2917.875

    In the interest of full disclosure, I am using the formula for Harris-Benedict provided by the wikipedia page.

    Now, you say you eat 3000 calories per day. Well, you're pretty much eating the precise amount you need to maintain your weight. You should probably cut your calorie intake by about 300-500 calories per day to lose the fat, while still going balls to the walls exercising.

    You should most likely eat somewhere between 2400 - 2600 calories per day, instead of 3000.

    Also, something that I have found that helped me drop down my body fat (currently around 9%) is to do HIIT, shorten your rest periods when lifting and/or lift in a circuit fashion. Just some suggestions.

    If there is any misinformation in my post, please let me know.

    I hope this was helpful!

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    Hmm thanks a lot guys but I think you don't understand what I'm saying, I have a VERY easy time losing weight on a scale but it seems I also have a very easy time losing muscle... That is why I'm eating 3000 cals to maintain right now. Whenever I did do all of what you advised, it was a big fail, I lost pounds but was never more cut and to me it just seemed like I lost a big amount of muscle.


    And to the ppl who said that testosterone had little to do with potential, that is most definitely wrong, just look at women, they have nowhere near men's potential in terms of muscle mass and low bodyfat percentage and it's almost 100% because of hormones.

  16. #16
    Seasoned M&S Veteran AToE's Avatar
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    They weren't saying that testosterone isn't important, they were saying that the natural differences in test from male to male aren't that important. If yours are low enough to be causing problems with gaining/keeping muscle mass, that means you should be talking to a doctor about it, because your test levels shouldn't be that low unless something is wrong with your health.

  17. #17
    E-Cowboy 2cents madjinx's Avatar
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    I just want to add, about women not being able to rival the growth of men.

    it isnt really about testosterone levels, its really more about the density, location, and number of androgen receptors women have. you notice women can often rival men in natural growth in some areas, and in places like glutes, even surpass.


    need to remember there is more than one hormone that can create muscle growth. what women lack in testosterone they make up for well in estrogen and adrenal hormones.
    Last edited by madjinx; 10-16-2012 at 06:30 PM.
    Current Supps: Controlled Labs Orange Triad, NOW Foods Ultra Omega-3, EvoMuse: Gut Health

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    Default

    Genes are hard to beat

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    Try consulting with a trainer. They can help customize a workout that is right for your body. This is a short read that has some good info Why Use Certified Trainers?
    Get fit or get out people.

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    Isn't estrogen a hormone that tends to help keep fat on? And no offence but no, women, can't rival men in muscle growth potential, look at the difference in size of the world's strongest most muscular men against the women.. pretty considerable difference.

    Anyway by genes I didn't only mean testosterone, I meant whatever else about genes that could have an effect on this

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    Quote Originally Posted by ClaytonPop View Post
    Try consulting with a trainer. They can help customize a workout that is right for your body. This is a short read that has some good info Why Use Certified Trainers?
    thanks I'll have a look at it!

  22. #22
    Seasoned M&S Veteran AToE's Avatar
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    Maybe outline your diet and routine (including rep ranges). As has been said here, people have differing genetics which allow for easier fatloss, or easier muscle gains, etc - but it's not to such a degree as to make something like going under 15% bodyfat impossible, not without actually having a dissorder, in which case it's a doctor that needs talking to.

    Even if we assume that ok, you have bad genes (which I am not assuming) - if the diet and exercise are right then whatever you want to acheive CAN be done, especially considering that you're not trying to bust 200lbs of lean mass, or 3% bodyweight, those kinds of extreme goals.

    If you're losing muscle to a great enough degree while losing weight that your bodyfat just won't drop lower, something is wrong with your workouts or your diet, great genes or poor genes aside.
    "what can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence"

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    Basically recheck your diet like everyone else is saying. Also just to give you a little perspective on why you shouldn't get hung up on body fat % numbers. In my exercise testing and prescription class, we had a lab where we measured body fat % using different methods. I'll just tell you about the bioeletrical impedance since that's the one you used. But I used two different ones for upper body (hold the device in hands) and lower body (stand on a scale barefoot); and I got two different readings, 15% and 20%. Now that's only a %5 error difference, but when we're talking in the context of our body fat %, it's HUGE. The results also depend on a ton of factors including when was the last time you ate, hours since you last exercised, is your body properly hydrated etc.

    Also, I'm 23 and 5'7", like another poster mentioned, you seem to be eating at about maintenance. I'd say drop down the calories 400-500, and keep a journal/food log to help you track the progress that way you stay on track. And this part I'm not entirely sure where I read it, but is your lifting routine set up to lift heavy? During a cutting phase, lifting heavy tends to preserve more muscle mass. Again, if anybody can confirm that would be great. Good luck!

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    Quote Originally Posted by AToE View Post
    Maybe outline your diet and routine (including rep ranges). As has been said here, people have differing genetics which allow for easier fatloss, or easier muscle gains, etc - but it's not to such a degree as to make something like going under 15% bodyfat impossible, not without actually having a dissorder, in which case it's a doctor that needs talking to.
    My routine (it's all pyramidal 12-10-8-6 reps)

    Day one: Back biceps

    Chin ups 4 sets
    Lat pulldown close grip 4sets
    Cable row 4 sets
    Lat pulldown machine 3 sets
    Dumbell curl 4sets
    Preacher's curl 3 sets
    Inclined hammer culrs 3 sets


    Day two: Pecs triceps

    Dumbell bench 4 sets
    inclined smith machine bench 4 sets
    Declined fly 4 sets
    fly machine 4 sets
    Sat tricep extension (one arm at a time) 4 sets
    cable tricep extension with a rope 4 sets
    Machine 4 sets
    Crunches 5 sets of max


    Day three: Legs

    Squat 4 sets
    Leg press 4 sets
    exercice for glutes 3 sets
    Leg extension-Leg curl uperset x4
    Calves with cable 4 sets


    Day four:

    DB Shoulder press 4 sets
    DB lat raises 4 sets
    Cable front raises 3 sets
    reversed fly 3 sets
    Shrugs 5 sets
    declined crunches 6 sets
    Last edited by Dario2622; 11-22-2012 at 05:16 PM.

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    What I ate today (typical day)

    1- Oats, yogourt and skim milk

    2- some horsemeat with wholegrain pasta and veggies.

    3- some tuna on crackers and a turkey sandwich

    4- Some bean soup and another turkey sandwich

    5- A green salad with lots of veggies, some cheese and eggs with olive oil

    6- cheese and soya beans with some casein protein.

 

 

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